Weird question

A car goes 30 mph down a hill and at bottom of the hill the car hits the break and try’s to turn to look up the hill.

OR a car goes 60 mph down a hill and then hits the breaks and trys to turn at the bottom to face up the hill.

WHAT CAR WILL HAVE MORE ROTATIONAL FORCE, LINEAR FORCE AND MOMENTUM?

This has nothing to do with pitching.

Could dm or Roger move this please?

Actually, I think he’s trying to prove something about force and momentum, which can have something to do with pitching. I’m curious to hear where he’s going with it.

I’ll have to wrap my brain around it before giving my non-physicist answer.

Well, why does he need to know which one has more rotational force? That’s all I want to know, I think he should ask how to relate that to pitching.

hes trying to make the point that u have to move quick to have better rotational force?
the car is the pitcher

Too many variables. You would have to assume that there is a maximum safe speed for the car to complete the rotation. Too fast and you would lose control or flip the car over. Depending on that aspect, the 30 mph car might be moving the same speed as the 60 mph car after application of the brakes and the turn being completed.

[quote=“RIstar”]A car goes 30 mph down a hill and at bottom of the hill the car hits the break and try’s to turn to look up the hill.

OR a car goes 60 mph down a hill and then hits the breaks and trys to turn at the bottom to face up the hill.

WHAT CAR WILL HAVE MORE ROTATIONAL FORCE, LINEAR FORCE AND MOMENTUM?[/quote]

We must first make an assumption about a potential variable, that being the mass of the car. Since it’s not given, we must assume it’s the same car and the same mass. If so, the car moving faster will have the greatest momentum, rotational force and linear force.

How does this relate to pitching? Offset pegged it correctly, I think. RIstar’s been saying this all along.

The thing that must be stated, yet again, is that any energy generated by movement of whatever speed is of no use at all if not used effectively and efficiently for a specific functional purpose. Move really, really fast in the stride and build up all kinds of momentum and you’ll not throw the ball any harder if that energy is dissipated or used up without being transferred eventually to the ball. Many things have to line up for it to happen.

So, RIstar, what’s your point? You know this has been said already.

My whole point for this post is to state a point of max poteinal force.

1st pitcher goes down the mound slow and doesn’t gain momentum till they let there foot down. Timing is perfect and the pitcher throws the ball corect.

NoW

2nd pitcher moves forward as soon as he lifts the leg off the ground {like randy johnson} and moves fast while doing so and weight transfer is perfect like pitcher 1 and throws the ball.

Which one creates more rotational force, linear force, momentum?

Whole point of the car is to take something out of baseball that deals with the physic’s of the 3 forces and to then apply them to pitching.

In pitching like a car you down a hill you gain momentum and linear force and rotational force and you plant with a car you brake and with a pitcher you plant you foot to stop momentum. Same forces.

SO which one creates more rotational force, linear force, and momentum if timing is good for both pitchers and the only change is the speed and earlly movement of pitcher 2?

[quote=“RIstar”]A car goes 30 mph down a hill and at bottom of the hill the car hits the break and try’s to turn to look up the hill.

OR a car goes 60 mph down a hill and then hits the breaks and trys to turn at the bottom to face up the hill.

WHAT CAR WILL HAVE MORE ROTATIONAL FORCE, LINEAR FORCE AND MOMENTUM?[/quote]

Man, RIstar is making this forum a one topic show. Please, find something different to harp on.

Chop Talk if you don’t have anything good to say don’t say it I’m trying to get a point across. Dm please tell me what you think?

I believe the 60 mph car will go faster. It will create more momentum and linear force.

Ok how bought the example of the two pitchers? stated above^^^^

I know what RIstar is trying to say. But becacuse I think he is hopeless isolating one aspect without considering the million other things in pitching I will play the role of devils advocate. For kicks if you will.

So the cars are attempting to rotate a full 180 degrees and face the opposite direction of there momentum, correct?

The car traveling 60mph will take longer to rotate. Unless you flip it over.
The turning radius will be excessively wide and its path will take to long to travel.

The 30mph car can take a more efficient and tighter turn thus completing the objective quicker.

If the cars are ok to crash and burn then sure you might be able to whip it around at 60mph. Only problem is the driver would be dead…

My point being that just because one factor is potentially better doesn’t mean it won’t create a negative effect on other factors.

Nice point but that was a example read about the 2 pitchers and tell me which will get more Linear force, Rotational force and momentum?

1st pitcher goes down the mound slow and doesn’t gain momentum till they let there foot down. Timing is perfect and the pitcher throws the ball corect.

NoW

2nd pitcher moves forward as soon as he lifts the leg off the ground {like randy johnson} and moves fast while doing so and weight transfer is perfect like pitcher 1 and throws the ball.

Which one creates more rotational force, linear force, momentum?

Ah, but you completely missed my point.

I already said I understand your point.

BUT, what if a pitcher is large, has long limbs, and tendon attachments relatively close to the joints (worse leverage).

If he moves quickly he will never be able to coordinate everything. And well if he doesn’t have as much muscular coordination because of his size he won’t even be able to activate all of his muscles in a short amount of time.

If he slows down he can use his massive levers to generate force. And he can fully activate more motor units in his body.

I assure you more motor units > moving hips forward faster.

The longer the levers, the slower you can move and generate the same amount of force.

Sure Randy Johnson starts moving forward early and he’s big, that’s fine. However the prototypical fast mover on the mound is SMALL.
Lincecum for instance.
We had a high school kid here hitting 92. He only weighs 175lbs and that is what part of people marvel at. He moved extremely fast. People also predict he will get hurt soon because he moves fast and violently.

Ok forget all the other things you just said and agree with me that to get max potiental force that you need to do what pitcher 2 does?

Yes other way’s work but there is more efficent way’s too.

do you think pitcher 2 can have more rotational force, linear force and momentum?

Uh yeah.

No one has disagreed with you on that?

I guess I’m missing the point?

My whole point on this was to prove that going earlly and moving fast with proper timing can get you to throw at max potiental force if timing is just right.

So take a big pitcher have him go earlly and fast {a good speed his fast}
and with good timing and he will be able to reach make force and apply that to the ball if timing is ok.

RIStar, the problem here is that you are trying to say that there is only one (mechanical) way to acheive these things. If this were true then you would see every pitcher throwing exactly the same way. In reality, you’d be hard pressed to find two pitchers who throw exactly the same.

What might be right for one, might not be right for some. Cause it takes different strokes… :lol:

You don’t get it i have said there are other way’s to throw hard but this way will get max potietal force ok. but yes there are other way’s