in your book you give the long toss program and the time. how is the time divided between distances? if it says 90 - 120 feet. 15 minutes. how is that divided between the two?
also during the fall we do a 6 week long toss program - no throwing off the mound - high school. how would you modify for that? we are looking for improvement in velocity.
NO THROWING OFF A MOUND?
Lol who ever is running your program doesn’t understand pitching at all. How are you going to get good with out throwing off a mound?
Stupid Idea not to throw of the mound because that’s what you do in the game work on skills you do in the game.
Long toss is good but NO THROWING you must e kidding me.
the way to suggest something is to go like “i think you should add mound work to that program because…”
“stupid. everything is stupid. wasteful. everything is a waste.”
Long Toss will help your control because it will solidify your release point.
You will gain more arm speed and your mechanics will get better which adds extra velocity.
Well lets see only long toss no one see anything wrong?
Oo did you know the release point in long toss is different from on a mound? so long toss will not help with that will it.
some long toss is ok but NO MOUND THROWING?
we cant throw off the mound because its against the rules in our state. i was looking for coaches not kids to reply to this question. im the one in charge of our program and we’ve been very successful - with 3 all-state pitchers in the last 4 years. im looking for mature responses.
Well ok you should have stated that there was no mound throwing aloud then I would have said long toss away.
Sorry for the Dick Mills commercial coach, as you can see he’s in sad need of a deprogrammer…mostly harmless :roll: .
You haven’t posted for some time and it’s good to see you again. While I’m a firm believer in long toss as part of the program (Time in Tuff Cuff I believe is decreasing so it’s more 90 and less 120), I’m not sure of a direct path from long toss to velo…outside of much better arm health. I know (Because I know of the quality of your program from your previous visits) you’re working a comprehensive program so please, if you are already doing these things…it ain’t a surprise to me. What I’ve seen from our pitching coach (Rick Wilkens) in a non mound situations designed for velo increase are multi-station set-ups, working both mechanic refinement type drill work (No need for a mound here) in conjunction with targeted strength stuff (balance beam work with 2-3 lb weights, med ball, etc.), long toss, a running program and some tubing (He also recommended some rice bucket stuff in the evenings to failure), it’s about a 2 hour program.
Are you harping diet? We had a specific period of protien supplementation (Fresh to soph off-season), which gained him mass without getting him muscle bound…while working a specific and just general lifting regieme that summer (As he enters his Sr year he’s cruises 88-92, and we’ve consistantly added mph per year at 6’ 170-5).
Is this rule during the fall? We finally, here in Fla are able to play a full fall season. I suspect your guys are doing a summer ball thing then by State rules aren’t able to throw on a mound until what Feb.?
We saw a Tenn team play at The National Wood Bat Championships (18u), earlier this month up in Atlanta…they wore UT colors…Are you familiar? (They were pretty daggone good!).
[quote=“annarborkid”]Long Toss will help your control because it will solidify your release point.[/quote]How does that work when, in long toss, you have a different target?
[quote=“annarborkid”]… your mechanics will get better which adds extra velocity.[/quote]Again, how will learning long toss mechanics benefit your mechanics for throwing off a mound?
[quote=“jdfromfla”]…I’m not sure of a direct path from long toss to velo…outside of much better arm health.[/quote]I’m with ya there jd. My take on long toss is that it won’t, directly, increase velo and it definitely won’t help with release point, although I don’t think experienced long toss advocates suggest that it does. I’ve heard it said that long toss doesn’t have to interfere with mound pitching release points because you aren’t replacing the mound completely.
My problem with much of what I see out there about arm health programs is that they all have the challenge of strengthening and conditioning the relevant muscles and connective tissues at the range of motion they are put into during pitching. For example, tubing exercises are typically done through 90 degrees of internal or external rotation. In actual pitching, the humerus goes through much more than that when it lays back to full external rotation. If you don’t condition at that range, those muscles and connective tissues will be unfamiliar with the stresses they will be expected to withstand.
So, this is where I believe long toss comes in very well. You can get to that range of motion in a controlled way. Distance is the controlling factor. Weighted balls could also come in here. The point being, throwing is an excellent way of conditioning those tissues at that range. I’m not sure if you can do it any other way but the fitness gurus out there may be able to elaborate on other ways.
It will force your elbow to get up to its proper position. Which will help gain more speed and allow you to have control after the first couple of pitches because your shoulder wont get as tired.