Throwing a two seamer that runs in on arm side batters


#1

For some god knows reason, I cannot get the ball to run in on arm side hitters. I am a right handed pitcher in my freshman year in college. The ball runs back out over the plate like a hanging cutter. My hand is pronating correctly and the spin on the ball is right to left out of my hand. Any suggestions on how to get the ball to tail the way its supposed to when throwing a two seamer.


#2

Don’t try to pronate your wrist. Instead try to throw it just like your 4SFB. Throw it with the most speed you can get on it. I throw about 80-85mph and I get about 8in. of movement. I am also right handed. Just throw it like it’s name FAST BALL. Watch how your fingers roll off of the ball bacause their isn’t much difference between the cutter grip and the 2SFB basides your fingers on one side of the ball than the other side, off balance of pressure mixed with a correct spin gives you a cutter. Also, watch where you put your thumb and how hard you squeeze the ball wiht certain fingers. Good Luck, Keenan


#3

Do you throw over the top, 3/4, sidearm? Generally pitchers who throw 3/4 or lower are the ones who tend to get armside run. You can pronate and get cutter type movement (although the spin wouldn’t be the right to left you say you are seeing), much the way a tennis spin serve is hit with the racket going from down/in to up/out across the back of a ball, so don’t try to pronate to get run on the ball as you’ll just lose velocity. Just keep your fingers behind the ball without consciously trying to pronate and throw 3/4 or lower and you should get a bit of run. Movement is something that tends to come naturally and some people just have to focus on velocity and location to make up for lack of movement on their fastball. Fastballs with less movement are easier to locate.


#4

There is actually no pronation involved in a cut fastball. It is simply starting with the 2SFB grip and sliding your pointer finger together with your middle finger on the arm side of the ball. Then you simply just throw like a fast ball. Lay on your back and toss the ball towards the ceiling and you will notice that your middle finger gives you all the rotation that you need. That is how you throw a cutter. Notice that there is no pronation involved. It’s as simple as a 2SFM or a 4SFB. No snapping the wrist or pronating it just it’s all about finger pressure,grip, and release. Just ask Mariano Rivera. The best cutter in the MLB.


#5

thanks everyone for the advice, I throw a little higher then three quarters, hopefully if I can to the point where you guys are at with your 2 seamers I should be a little more effective against left handed hitters and jamming the rightys when they try crowding the plate


#6

No problem. And you said you throw a little more than 3/4 then try and develop a 12-6 curve. It’s more of a straight over the top curveball where you break your wrist straight down towards the ground. Trust me, if you lke movement you will love this pitch. It breaks like a foot straight down. It’s like a slow forkball in a way. Well good luck to you.


#7

Actually if you look closely at clips Rivera is just throwing a very hard slider and he does turn his wrist. That’s why he gets more movement. It would probably destroy his elbow except he had TJ surgery early in his career because of the way he was turning his wrist to try and get movement (I’m not sure if it was TJ surgery or just surgery to move the nerve). The TJ surgery is probably the only reason he can still get away with throwing it the way he does. I wouldn’t recommend playing around with wrist movement to bring on TJ surgery. Rivera’s case is one of a kind.

Hmmm…thinking back I threw my slider almost as fast as my fastball 30+ years ago and I think I have a partial tear in my UCL. Time for TJ and a comeback. Think they need pitchers with 65 mph cutters? :slight_smile:

No you don’t pronate to try and throw a cutter. I was just saying that even with pronation it is possible to get that type of spin if your fingers are brushing across the back of the ball from in to out as you throw and bringing up the possibility that he wasn’t getting the action he thought he should be getting from the pronation.

I wouldn’t recommend trying to change your arm slot at this point. Try throwing your 2 seamer with your pointing finger against a seam and your middle finger not on a seam at all. That might give you a little down and in movement on a righty. If that doesn’t work just play with other finger locations and pressure to see if you can find something that does work for you. It takes time, so don’t give up if you don’t get consistent movement right away. Do be careful to not start turning your wrist thinking that you are just applying finger pressure.


#8

I agree with your post. It was great. I really dno’t care for the cutter myself. There are not many leftys in highschool for me anyways and thats the only thing I really see the cutter thrown for to run in on leftys and saw the bat off like the 2SFB for rightys. I personally hate the slider because of its more a side arm arm slot. I throw 3/4 or straight over the top for my 12-6 curve to drop straight down. I like the 2SFB and I throw mine like you said with the pointer on the seam and the middle finger on the inside of the ball so it will get a good rotation towards a righty. Anyways, nice post CADad. :smiley:


#9

yea I do throw the 12 to 6 and it is a very effective pitch, my velocity is pretty good right now around 86, 87 I just turned 18 so im hoping i can get closer to that magic number but right now its not as easy to blow people away in college then it was in highschool. Im working on a circle change but its very inconsistent as of now but with all you guys giving advice I think I pick up a pretty good feel for the 2 seamer get some movement and start learning to actually pitch and not just throw, thanks guys


#10

Yeah, no problem. I am 17 and a juinor in highschool. I also throw the 12-6. I hit 80-85mph consistantly now. I would advise the three-finger change-up like Kenny Rogers throws of the Detroit Tigers. On a change-up you reall aren’t looking for movement, you are just looking for a speed change to throw the batters timing off. It is a easy pitch to control and not hard to learn. There are 2 variations, the pitch-fork variation and the flat three-finger variation. Pitchfork is gripped by placing the ball like a 2 seamer but your middle finger in between the seams and your pointer finger and your ring finger on the opposite sides of the ball. This being gripped like this wiil create friction, thus slowing the ball down creating the change-up. This is a more advanced change-up and is harder to control. I would try the flat finger variation to start out with if this is your first time learning. This is done by holding the ball exactly the same but not putting your pointer and ring fingers on the sides of the ball, I mean this variation isn’t held as deep as the other. It doesn’t create as much friction as the other but it will get the job done.

 I also have release point problems with the Circle-Change. In my opinion it is not worth the movement. Like I said a change is to mess up a batters timing by speed not movement. Opposed to a 12-6 curve or even a Knuckle curve that is thrown for the movement to fool the batter. Each pitch is designed for a purpose, and I personally just don't think that the Circle-Change even with it's popularity it is worth the hassel to learn. The movement is not worth it. It is just about 4-6in. Which is not small ,but the change-up is a off speed pitch not a breaking ball. But if you really want to learn it bad I would encourage you. Note that some people though are not meant to throw certain pitches. Try not to spend too much time learning a pitch you simply just cannot throw. Don't let the pitch control you, you control the pitch. Goodluck.