Son only throws gyro spin

hey,
my son is 11u. been playing baseball for 1.5 years now. We’ve just been throwing without me paying attention to his ball movement.

i recently found out, i should be looking for backspin on his throws. My son ONLY throws with serious nasty gyro spin. Meaning the ball looks like a football.

I’ve been trying to fix this for 4-5 months now… tons of money spent on coaching, etc…i feel like they’ve made the rest of his throwing worse.

Now he’s dropped like 5-8mph on his throws, (sitting 45mph) short arms, etc… its a full disaster now.

Anyone have a kid that only throws a “football” spin (gyro) and fix it?
I know he’s coming around it, and not getting behind it… but he can’t seem to correct it, and i don’t know any drills to fix it.

any help would be great… part of me feels like maybe i’m running an amazing pitcher because i’m stopping him from doing something hes beeen doing for a long while with no issues… but i feel like i need to break it down now, and rebuild it before its too late.

thanks again.

Called spiraling by Driveline. My kid threw very hard at that age and he ended up getting growth plate issues. Driveline explained it to me as the two arm bones would slam together with spiraling. When pronation occurred immediately after release, it prevented that from happening. I just rode him but I would say the towel drill might be beneficial. Check out Driveline’s website too….they might have some info published. When my kid would do it, it looked like a cutter and would have glove side run. I know this doesn’t help but there really isn’t a lot of info out there. My guess is, the back and rear delt are weak.

jxr0062d,

“my son is 11u. been playing baseball for 1.5 years now.”

He is chronologically 11. What is his biological age? This is what matters in terms of correct physical development. He may be Advanced, Delayed or Equated. You need to know! there is up to a 5 year difference between the highs and lows. This way you can better plan his skill development verses bone growths ability to withstand the joint assault.

“We’ve just been throwing without me paying attention to his ball movement.”

Ball movement will not tell you how he threw a throws drive and release, in that you can make the ball move the same direction laterally by Forearm supination or Forearm pronation.

“i recently found out, i should be looking for backspin on his throws.”

Yes, backspin with equated axis presentation (one of two small circles spinning at either end of it’s rotational axis of the ball) side to side horizontally gives you the straightest throw. When the ball is tilted in the slightest manor exposing the faster side of the circle of friction it will cause more pressure on one side of the ball, causing lateral movement in the opposite direction (slider, cutter, Sinker, curve)

“My son ONLY throws with serious nasty gyro spin. Meaning the ball looks like a football.”

He intuitively Forearm drive supinates his throw types and it gets worse as they drops down their drive arm vector. This has to be mitigated before serious damage occurs at the Elbow. Most all kids do this, some not so bad but still doing it and the damage just keeps accumulating by ballistic hyper extension.

“ tons of money spent on coaching”

Remember what is taught today is an extension of what was taught before. You only need look at the admitted physical joint and soft tissue injuries to know that failed and continues to.

“ i feel like they’ve made the rest of his throwing worse.”

Don’t be surprised when I tell you none of them really knows what they are doing. They are just copying what they have heard and seen in the past. Just ask them the difference between Forearm supination and Forearm pronation drive and the effect on the Elbow? Watch them dance. many say they do something about it but in reality, they do not! These people have had their chance to understand this but take the easy route and follow the same path that was blazed before them. Insanity.

“Now he’s dropped like 5-8mph on his throws, (sitting 45mph) short arms, etc… its a full disaster now.”

fathers and Mothers (Mothers strongly) need to take over, you do not need any of these Org’s. They > are incapable of teaching safe and sane mechanics.

“Anyone have a kid that only throws a “football” spin (gyro) and fix it?”

I’ve had to fix every kid for the last 30 years of professional private instruction, the first 20 years I spent ruining arms by letting it happen by ignorance some worse but the recipe is the same.

“I know he’s coming around it, and not getting behind it…”

You need to read at DrMikeMarshall.com and absorb the information there.

You only need yourself and time!

“don’t know any drills to fix it.”

Dr. Marshall’s pedagogy is complete, comprehensive, merited and free. The best drills and advice that can be found. You will learn in detail how adolescent males grow.

“part of me feels like maybe I’m running an amazing pitcher because I’m stopping him from doing something hes beeen doing for a long while”

Along while? If you wait and he turns 16 and he is still coming around it, it will be locked in more. If he is a fast twitcher he will be asked to compete, this is where the supination grinds until failure.

Understand that he has fallen into this intuitively because our arm off to the side, all kids need to be taught how to drive the ball correctly, none do, yours is just a little worse.

“ i feel like i need to break it down now, and rebuild it before its too late.”

Start by talking to him about the 2 ways the Forearm travels in longitudinal rotational axis.

The one he performs is Forearm supination drive, is a pathomechanic (injurious by mechanics). It is identified by the Elbow driving down and the ball side thumb turning up.

The other he should be using is Forearm pronation drive and recovery, it’s healthy for the Elbow and Forearm joints.

It is identified by the Elbow rotating up and the ball side thumb turning down.

This drive orientation is gateway set up by how he transitions his Humerus and Forearm heading back, He must learn to do the opposite arm articulations going back to full length that the pronated drive is performed forwards and arrive at the back at same time his glove side foot plants.

He can be set into this lengthened position to perform one of the best drills that exists called the “No stride drill” where he feels how to concentrate on how to articulate his first move forwards by pulling against the glove side leg, rotating the shoulder and Elbow up to initiate body rotation from length.

For radicalized supinators I have them immediately learn how to throw a Screwball change up and fastball Sinker that is the almost exact opposite of the supinated release. he will have to learn how to articulate Ulnar flexion and radial flexion of the wrist to attain lateral movement to both side by powerfully pronating all his pitch types

These are the most important teaches any thrower can learn. They will virtually eliminate the need for pitch counts for adults.

If you care enough you got some read’in ta do.

JXR,

This video explains and demonstrates an excellent throwing drill -

Watch this with your son - Pitching Drill - Knee Drill for Pitchers - YouTube - The only thing I would do differently is have your son show the baseball more towards the shortstop position and not the centerfield position to prevent injury.

Also, have him grip the ball with a 2-seam grip - the two seams that are very close together that make up what we call the runway, and when he follows through, make sure the ball is on a perfect backspin - you can see this by standing behind him and watching the ball. Finally, when throwing, have him keep his throwing elbow at least parallel with his shoulder to prevent injury.

Have him start throwing the ball slowly until he gets the backspin in the desired position.

I hope this helps,

Topgun,
Former Pitcher and Current Pitching Coach