Pitchers and cockieness MUST SEE


#1

Im a catcher and try to help my pitchers out as mutch as I can. I got in a couple of disputes with pitchers about me calling pitches. That scared away a few pitchers and led to less playing time. The pitchers were allways the dumbest kids on the team too so it didnt make any sense. You are proably thinking that im soo full of my self and i think I Know everything. I dont, i have a lot to learn but I am one of the smartest kids on the team if not the smartest. Anyone else with similar problems with a catcher or pitcher calling pitches? i feel the catcher has the right tocall the pitches he may see things differently than the pitcher

PLEASE comment back :!: :baseballpitcher:


#2

It has to be a cooperative effort—the pitcher and the catcher working together as a team. Calling pitches can be a very tricky business, and the batterymates have to get together beforehand and decide under what circumstances the catcher would call the pitches and when the pitcher should do it. I remember when I pitched, many moons ago, my catcher and I would have a pregame conference about this, and as a rule I would let him call the pitches, simply because he knew my stuff and what I could do with it (I was a snake-jazz pitcher, not much on speed but a lot of good breaking pitches and the control and command to go with them). There were a couple of specific situations where I would call the pitches; the first was when there happened to be a runner on second base, and this is important because the runner is in a position to steal the signs and relay them to the hitter. I remember my pitching coach telling me that if I didn’t watch out the runner would steal my shoes! The second such situation would come about when I, a true sidearmer, was going to crossfire a pitch—I would signal to my catcher that I was going to do this, often by blowing a big bubble with my gum.
And on occasion when I had to work with a substitute catcher who did not know my stuff I would tell him that I would call the pitches, much the same way that an old St. Louis Cardinals pitcher named Howie Pollet used to do.
I believe that there is a big difference between being confident in your ability behind the plate and being too cocky. The former is highly desirable; the latter is not, and I suspect that the reason some pitchers refuse to work with you is that this cockiness is coming through too much. I would suggest that you cool it somewhat. Both you and the pitchers you work with will be much better off. 8) :slight_smile:


#3

Sure, as the catcher you can call the pitches but at the end of the day the pitcher knows what’s going to work for him and what’s not. You can’t get him to setup a pitch that isn’t working, or if you’re looking to setup differently, it’s not your call. As anyone but a pitcher, you’ll never know how his pitches are working at that moment.

It sounds like you just don’t have any respect for your pitchers and aren’t getting playing time because of your attitude, to be honest. The pitchers are the dumbest kids, really? It takes more than an arm to pitch. That attitude is what lost you your pitchers.


#4

I know what your saying and I knew someone would say that i am a jerk but if you knew who these kids were they are not the brightest guys. The only thing they got is their arm. I am one of the most passionate guys about baseball proably in my area. I have a system that I go over what pitches im gonna call im what counts and be absoutly honest with them saying that if their curveball sucks that day I will call more changeups or somthing. Im sorry if im sounding like a jerk but this is the way i play.

thanks for the comments


#5

You guys should discuss your gameplan well before the game even starts. Actually, you should know the gameplan before his pregame session in the bullpen. If all things go according to plan, it should be easy to get into a rythm. However, it often times doesn’t work this way, which is when you need to be talking to the pitcher in between innings and making mound visits when necessary.

One thing you need to understand about pitchers. It’s incredibly important to be 100% convicted in what pitch we are throwing. Pitch execution is obviously very important with our success. If I’m not convinced or don’t feel comfortable with a particular pitch I’m going to throw, then there’s a good chance I’m not going to execute it. A pitchers psyche and mentality needs to be strong. That’s why I’m not a big advocate of coaches calling pitches, especially at higher levels. Alot of times a pitch thrown with conviction, even though it may be the wrong one, is way more effective than the “iffy” pitch thrown at the right time.

Personally, at my level I will always have a pitch in my head. If the catcher doesn’t put that finger down I’m going to shake. If he wants to come out and talk to me about the pitch and change in gameplan, that’s fine.

And remember, be calm and talk easy to pitchers, nobody ever likes a bossy catcher.


#6

Sorry if I repeat no time to read the other posts.

Its a tricky situation. If the catcher is more experienced than the pitcher they should be calling pitches. But if the catcher is nasty towards the pitcher about him calling his own pitches this could lead to a negative situation with the pitcher and being a baby and not listening. Teamwork between catcher and pitcher is really needed, so as a catcher it is right for you to keep this balance. Even if it means not calling pitches. You could learn somethign yourself also. Or the pitcher can realize he is wrong and needs to listen to the catcher.

Sometimes the pitcher knows certain pitches that aren’t working for him, something you might not know.

I really think its a judgement call and depends on the specific situation.


#7

My sentiments exactly!
And there are times when a catcher might know something the pitcher is not aware of—like the time when the Yankees’ Chien-Ming Wang was pitching against the Royals in Kansas City, and he ran into some trouble early in the game. Jorge Posada went out to the mound and told Wang to shorten his stride, and he knew what he was talking about—Wang is a sinkerball pitcher, and the mound at Kauffman Stadium is lower and flatter than at any other ballpark, and for a sinkerballer that can spell disaster! So Wang shortened his stride, pitched seven strong innings and got the win. If you’re a sinkerballer you need to make sure the mound is high enough, and Posada knew this.
As far as pitches not working is concerned, I mentioned in an earlier post that when a pitcher is warming up in the bullpen, whether it be for a start or to come into the game in relief, it’s important to throw all his or her pitches to see how they’re working. If you’re having trouble with one pitch—say, the curve ball is misbehaving—best to leave it alone and go with your other stuff.
As I said—it has to be a cooperative effort. 8)


#8

As said before, the pitcher and the catcher must work together and mesh well for a successful game. The catcher may know some things that the hitter doesn’t about hitters or how an opponent is hitting in different locations, pitches, etc. However, the pitcher also has control over his pitches, knows what is working for him, and he could be feeling more confident with one pitch over another. I have had the great chance to work with a catcher who goes well with me, and I’ve worked well with almost all that I’ve had a chance to pitch to. Something that the catchers do have to be aware of, if your a young age, is becoming a coach and overdoing the advice given to the pitcher. I know that pitchers (myself included sometime) just need time to think about what is going wrong without someone, especially a kid my age, overdoing it and really trying to lengthen out “advice” that a pitcher may not want.


#9

I do not know how many times i have said this to other pitchers… “chemistry is key to run a team”

make a game plan ahead the game and see how it plays out. :smiley:


#10

when i’m not pitching, i’m usually catching. so i have both sides. i think the catcher should be able to call pitches, because sometimes a pitcher can have too much confidence in a certain pitch, when in actuallity, it might not be that good. at the same time though, the pitcher is the one throwing the pitch.


#11

I know how you feel, I myself is a catcher, and I try to make my pitchers do pitches they don’t feel comfortable with. I tell them to mix it up so the hitters won’t wait on fastballs every count. I hate it when they don’t trust their stuff, and they just throw a fastball and gets hit all the time.


#12

as a pitcher, there are certain times that i feel my fastball is unhittable, and i feel like id rather throw that then a curveball. i only would shrugg off a pitch that i know the batter would hit. there are certain kids on my team that dont listen to the catchers and get lit up. just remember that if they dont throw what you wanted them to throw, and they get lit up. its on them, not you.


#13

I have had some really smart catchers and some really dumb ones. But there is usually a pretty consistent theme with this scenario - guys that shake off too much get lit up, and guys that listen look like superstars. Unless the catcher is just braindead and cant walk and chew gum.
I usually listen, although from time to time I will shake off if I’m blowing fastballs past guys, or if my curve is just disgusting that day. but it all comes together to a single goal. A swing and a miss.
It is a cooperative effort and a mutual goal, so the two should always work together< and a good pair will know what each other are thinking after some time.


#14

Exactly what I have been saying time and again—it has to be a cooperative effort, the pitcher and the catcher working together as a team. The catcher has to know the pitcher’s stuff and what he can do with it, and there will be times—particular strategic situations—where the pitcher needs to call the pitches, such as when there’s a runner on second. And both batterymates need to think along the same lines—be on the save wavelength, so to speak. When you have that you’re going to get a lot of wins. :slight_smile:


#15

My catcher is calling the game until he puts down something I don’t want to throw. :wink:

My freshman and sophomore year my coach called my games. If I wanted to shake him I was allowed to as long as i came back with a good reason for shaking.

My junior year my coach let me call my own games, and I called my own games in summer leagues. This lead to an increase in complete games and wins coincidentally.

Including wins over Penn State, and UMaryland 8)


#16

usually i will just trust whatever the catcher puts down and trust that its right… only when i feel strongly one way do i shake him off.

I do this primarily b/c i know that i have a tendancy to over-analyze and over-think, and its too much for me to have to stress over pitch selection every pitch while also focusing on execution.

With men on base or to tough hitters i usually get more involved, but for the most part it just works better for me to trust the catcher, provided he’s got a clue and we’ve agreed on a general game plan beforehand.

of course, if i don’t like what the guy is doing, which usually means he’s getting too cute calling too many breaking balls, i try to set him straight … in the end its always a two way street… a catcher who doesn’t have a feel for your approach can ruin your day.