Need to gain mph

I really need to gain about 8 mph on my fastball by february what are some good workouts that can help me reach this goal other that TUFFCUFF I have tried it for about two months and haven’t noticed a very big difference

Just taking a guess here, but it sure sounds like you’re gonna be trying out for the HS team next year, and someone told you that in order to make the team, you need to throw 8MPH faster than you do now.

All I can say is, there are no magic pills. If you’ve already got your mechanics where they’re pretty solid, all you can really do is wait until your body matures to the point where your capacity to throw harder increases to the point where it either matches your goals, or shows you it just ain’t ever gonna happen.

Just be careful and don’t try to do too much too fast, and try to keep in mind that there are other qualities a pitcher can possess that allows him to make a HS team, than velocity.

You are correct with me trying out for the high school team. The coach has two tryouts each year and I didn’t not make the first one. I asked him what I needed to improve to make the next one and he said my speed was what needed the most work. Right now I only top out at 63 which is very bad for a freashman pitcher and I need to get into 70’s if I want a shot at making it

your best shot at increasing velocity quickly…is to make adjustments to your mechanics. post a video and people can give you some advice

[quote=“scorekeeper”]

all you can really do is wait until your body matures to the point where your capacity to throw harder increases to the point where it either matches your goals, or shows you it just ain’t ever gonna happen.

Just be careful and don’t try to do too much too fast, and try to keep in mind that there are other qualities a pitcher can possess that allows him to make a HS team, than velocity.[/quote]

this is such an awful attitude to take as a high school pitcher…I don’t know his exact situation but I’d be willing to bet he is rail-thin with novice strength levels…he posted in another thread about running cross country…maybe he should focus on improving his base strength levels…this could DEFINITELY give him that 8 mph he is looking for. It’s pretty difficult NOT to throw in the 70s at the very least when you have some decent strength levels. If not, there are some GLARING mechanical issues holding the player back.

It’s unfortunate more people don’t realize the extraordinary benefits that can be had by a legitimate strength training program. And novice trainees are exactly the ones that experience absurd leaps in performance and velocity. Advising one to “wait until his body matures” is potentially misleading and harmful advice.

Indeed. But sadly, this is the approach that the NPA and other “safe” organizations take.

I have good mechanics thanks to a lucky break wwhen I got a college pitching coach to work with me so I think my main problem is strength right now I am not overly weak Or completely ripped. I’m mostly lean muscled and could put on some muscle. I know my mechanics are not spot on and Im still working on them but right now what I really need is a workout program to build the right types of muscles to gain velo

Indeed. But sadly, this is the approach that the NPA and other “safe” organizations take.[/quote]
Wow. You couldn’t be more wrong, Kyle. Seems like you’ve really got it out for the NPA lately. :reallyconfused:

It’s funny, I was just reading a comment on another board about how House’s stuff is more focused on conditioning. That was wrong, too. They put equal focus on mechanics and strength conditioning. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve heard someone from the NPA say “You’re only strong as your weakest link”.

House and the NPA preach the four legs of pitching: mechanics, strength/flexibility, nutrition, and mental/emotional. They also preach their fitness pyramid which has foundation fitness at the bottom, joint integrity/stability training at the next level, followed by functional strength training using machines, functional strength training use free weights, and, at the top of the pyramid, velocity training using weighted implements. You start at the bottom of the pyramid and work your way up. The foundation fitness program is intended to eliminate imbalances in the body and it was created because they felt this was an area often overlooked. I’m sure you would agree that imbalances in the body not only affect performance but can lead to injury. The only way to eliminate them is to identify them and then strengthen the weak parts of your body.

I have it out for the NPA selling $60 mouthguards and saying we need to follow their conservative plans and take $1000 training courses lest we ruin pitchers. Yes. I have a problem with those two facets of their organization’s concepts.

Machines are not functional in any sense of the word, aside from the fact that they do function when you use them. But athletic transfer is minimal.

The NPA is far behind even the most rudimentary research (completed by Soviets in the 50’s for crying out loud) when it comes to understanding the role of barbell and strength training in athletes. Joint stability/integrity improves as a result of free weight training. So does flexibility. The idea that flexibility and mobility are lessened by barbell squats, deadlifts, and other movements has no basis in reality - and is in fact more likely to happen with restricted ROM movements found on machine-based solutions.

I have no real problem with the majority of what the NPA says. I do have a problem with the NPA members endorsing:

  1. 3P Sports Biomechanical Analysis Techniques (a borderline scam)
  2. Insanely expensive training courses filled with research that is out of date or freely available
  3. Not publishing research openly to allow for others to attempt to duplicate their results

The NPA exists to make money. And there’s nothing wrong with that. But let’s call it like it is.

I agree their stuff ain’t cheap (although their books and videos are very reasonably priced). To say they claim we must “take their $1000 training courses lest we ruin pitchers” is a bit of an exageration, IMHO.

[quote]Machines are not functional in any sense of the word, aside from the fact that they do function when you use them. But athletic transfer is minimal.

The NPA is far behind even the most rudimentary research (completed by Soviets in the 50’s for crying out loud) when it comes to understanding the role of barbell and strength training in athletes. Joint stability/integrity improves as a result of free weight training. So does flexibility. The idea that flexibility and mobility are lessened by barbell squats, deadlifts, and other movements has no basis in reality - and is in fact more likely to happen with restricted ROM movements found on machine-based solutions.[/quote]
You seem to be referring to claims made by the NPA about the lessoning of flexibility and mobility that I am not aware of. But, since this area is not my strong point, let me ask you some questions. Are you saying doing things like resistance tubing exercises should be abandoned for free weights? Is it a waste of time to focus on joint stability separately? Can joint stability be addressed comprehensively using free weight exercises that are appropriate for pitchers or does the set of lifts/exercises that are appropriate for pitchers not adequately cover joint stability?

[quote]I have no real problem with the majority of what the NPA says. I do have a problem with the NPA members endorsing:

  1. 3P Sports Biomechanical Analysis Techniques (a borderline scam)[/quote]
    I share your concerns about 3P but they’re based on things I’ve read on the internet - hearsay - so I reserve judgement.

Again, I agree their stuff ain’t cheap. But I disagree about their work being out of date. Maybe some of their strength training work is out of date in a general sense but not so much in its application to pitchers. Much of their work is debunking old conventional wisdom using science. Can’t say I’ve seen anyone else do that.

Got any specific examples?

I disagree. The NPA has to make money in order to exist. Their employees don’t work for free. I’m sure you already know how difficult it is to make a living doing this kind of stuff. The NPA exists in order to advance the science behind pitching and to help pitchers both perform better and stay healthier.

Respectively:

No. We use them both.
Yes, generally.
Yes, free weight exercises generally can improve joint stability enough on their own.

If someone has glaring movement pattern issues, those should be fixed. But this is very overwhelmingly not the case.

Yes. Let’s start with the mouthguard piece. House claims 2-3 MPH gains. I would like to see the research, the controls, and how the experiment was carried out.

Additionally, let’s expand this to ASMI. ASMI compares biomechanical kinematics and kinetics to a group of pitchers who throw 80-89 MPH and tell their clients to match these kinematics/kinetics. I would like to see the injury rates of this group per body part and general attrition patterns for this group.

Likewise, ASMI does not control for many anatomical variations. A specific example: Elite pitchers are far more likely to have flat acromions (not an acquired trait; this is wholly congenital) than the average person in a similar population. Knowing this, how can this affect how we tell people to match the kinematics and kinetics of an “elite” pitcher? This is not controlled for and not examined for. Admittedly, this requires invasive surgery or expensive procedures to determine, but it doesn’t make it any less important.

Teaching someone with a hooked acromion (Type III) to duplicate the mechanics of someone with a flat acromion is potentially very injurious.

Hm? I said there’s nothing wrong with the NPA wanting to make money. Nothing at all. But hell, I work for free all the time, and I’m the only one (as far as I can tell) building a low-cost biomechanical lab solution so people can start collecting data on their own rather than place central trust one organization.

As for the goal of helping pitchers perform better and healthier, I will only say this: What cannot be measured cannot be improved upon. Show me a control group of pitchers and a group of pitchers trained by NPA specialists and we’ll see just how effective their methods are.

I have done this and published my initial findings, all at my own expense. The NPA never has, and has vastly more resources than I.

LankyLefty,

Why do you take me for some kind of dolt who hasn’t got a clue about what different things can be done for an athlete to improve his/her performance? What I was doing was counseling the kid not to try to go too fast with anything, because that can definitely be dangerous! I wasn’t telling him to just sit there and do nothing but wait.

People need to be extremely careful in this kind of forum because you never know how someone reading what you write is going to respond. Would you want some youngster at that point in his life to suddenly start lifting heavy weights, throwing weighted balls, or some other things which should be approached very carefully without supervision? For all you know, he may decide to begin indulging in supplements to bulk up, but he may have some kind of disease that could be exacerbated by suddenly taking in a lot of supplements. And for that matter, he sure sounds like a prime candidate for someone who’d experiment with PEDs if he becomes convinced enough that its purely a strength issue.

well, I have not been on this forum as much as I used to be, but it looks like there are still some fiery debates going on.

As far as this quote is concerned, I respectfully disagree. Speaking with high level athletes (baseball, basketball, bodybuilders, personal trainers), and my own opinion is that machines certainly have their place. I would argue that there is an inverse relationship between SAFETY and EFFICIENCY in regards to your training devices.

Free weights (Dumbbells and Barbells and the like), will be the most efficient, deliver the most results, and give you the truest sense of your strength. They will also give you your highest level of innate risk. You could easily drop weight, weight could shift, if you have some sort of mistake weight could come crashing down on you.

Weight loaded machines (Hammer strength, leg press, smith machine and the like) will still perfectly exhaust muscles through what can be a full ROM if desired (not necessarily the perfect full ROM for every body type), gives you a fine opportunity to increase strength and power, and is still giving you an opportunity to move “free weights” with the plates that you decide to load. They are always safer than free weights because there is a much smaller chance of weight coming straight down on you especially if you have a somewhat competent training partner.

Cable machines (pulleys, pin weight machines) will typically be the easiest of all exercise mediums because of the helpful nature of the machines. If you are truly trying to get stronger, you don’t want that help. On the flip side though, they contain very little innate danger in using them. If you are struggling and let the weight go, all that will happen is the weight stack will crash safely away from you.

I believe that each training device has its place in a program. I must admit though that I do completely agree with you though that you can acheive joint stability and strength with free weights ESPECIALLY full range squats, deadlifts, and why not through in some cleans and high pulls.

To say that machines have no function though is not fair. Every athlete has different goals, while they may be similar, they are not exactly the same. A young athlete could make significant gains in their general foundation of strength through the safer, yet less effective machine devices.

PHEW lol that was a lot

There is also an inverse relationship between the restriction of ROM and usefulness. Machines force you into strict ROM patterns and specifically target certain muscle groups. This is great for bodybuilders or people rehabbing (though generally other movements are better) but not so much people who want athletic transfer.

As for the safety of free weights, the number of injuries from free weight trauma is so insignificant compare to the number of injuries from soccer games (the most injurious sport to youth). It is a vastly overblown “issue.”

Hm? I said there’s nothing wrong with the NPA wanting to make money. Nothing at all. But hell, I work for free all the time, and I’m the only one (as far as I can tell) building a low-cost biomechanical lab solution so people can start collecting data on their own rather than place central trust one organization.[/quote]
You said “The NPA exists to make money.” Making money is not the reason the NPA exists. Every person I’ve known at the NPA is a class act, they’re passionate about what they do, and they care.

[quote=“qcbaseball”][quote=“kyleb”]

Machines are not functional in any sense of the word, aside from the fact that they do function when you use them. But athletic transfer is minimal.

[/quote]

THIS.

Bottom line: athletes need to do as much training as possible with their feet on the ground. This is the only way to develop strength and power throughout the kinetic chain from foot to shoulder.

Its a myth that free weight training is more dangerous or risky than other types of training. We are in the trenches training athletes everyday. With proper progressions and coaching injuries on the training floor are quite rare.

We do use a fair amount of cables (Keiser pneumatic resistance) for movements such as chops, lifts, and rotational patterns…but again, feet on the floor

[quote=“scorekeeper”]LankyLefty,
I wasn’t telling him to just sit there and do nothing but wait.[/quote]
that sure is what it sounded like. Maybe you could have phrased it better but i was going off of what you wrote.

[quote=“scorekeeper”]
People need to be extremely careful in this kind of forum because you never know how someone reading what you write is going to respond. Would you want some youngster at that point in his life to suddenly start lifting heavy weights, throwing weighted balls, or some other things which should be approached very carefully without supervision? For all you know, he may decide to begin indulging in supplements to bulk up, but he may have some kind of disease that could be exacerbated by suddenly taking in a lot of supplements. And for that matter, he sure sounds like a prime candidate for someone who’d experiment with PEDs if he becomes convinced enough that its purely a strength issue.[/quote]

just because something is potentially dangerous if not done carefully or with supervision does not mean we should not do it. Rather, once a kid decides that he wants to undertake a strength and conditioning program he should take it upon himself to learn how to do so safely and effectively…this is how I learned. Furthermore he has plenty of resources at his disposal to use. But telling a kid to just let his body mature because weight training or (GASP) weighted balls could potentially be dangerous if done improperly is very poor advice IMO.

WHOA NELLIE!!!
Reading through all these posts pro and con I was once again reminded of the old poem about the six blind men and the elephant. The upshot of that poem was that not one of those old men ever grasped the true essence of the pachyderm.
So let me throw in my 75 cents’ worth (inflation, you know).
There are pitchers and there are pitchers. Some of them are blazing fireballers, like Feller, Raschi, Gibson, Verlander and Sabathia to name five. Others are finesse pitchers, not much on speed but who compensate very nicely with stuff, control, deception and misdirection—like Brecheen, Dickson, Lopat, Moyer, Maddux in his later years after he lost some of his velocity—and so on. There’s no such thing as “one size fits all”, because it doesn’t. One has to take each pitcher on his (or her) own terms and work to maximize the capabilities s/he has. Sure, there are various ways and means one can build up strength, but it has to vary with the individual.
One thing that would work very well with a lot of pitchers—it sure worked for me—is something I came to call “The Secret”; I have mentioned this many times in previous posts, and I’m surprised that more pitchers aren’t aware of it. I learned it by watching the Yankees’ Big Three rotation of the late 40s to mid-50s and observing just what they did and how they did it. I would watch them in practice and in games, and I noticed that they were all doing the same thing: they were driving off the lower half of the body, using the legs, the hips and the torso in one continuous (and, it seemed to me, seamless) motion, and they were all generating more power behind their pitches—not to mention taking a lot of pressure off the shoulder and arm so they could throw harder (and faster) with less effort. I saw this, and I made a note of it and started working on it on my own, and I realized that this was the real key to a pitcher’s power—the hips were the connection between the lower and upper halves of the body and it was necessary to get them fully involved. This is what the Hershiser drill is all about—getting the hips fully involved and establishing that connection—and those guys knew all about it way back in the day. Well, maybe I couldn’t increase my speed all that much—although I did top out in the low 80s—but I too found that I could throw harder with less effort.
Something else I found out: THROW EVERY DAY. Whether it be just 15 or 20 minutes of playing catch, or doing a full bullpen session a couple of times a week, that’s the best way to build up arm strength and arm flexibility. So I did that, and it was during the bullpen sessions I could work on things—a new pitch, refining an existing one, or some aspect of mechanics. That’s what bullpens are for!
And I had to laugh at the whole pro-and-con arguments about the mouthguards, because I have always seen them as just protection against getting your teeth knocked out of your mouth by a line drive hit right back at you! Better to work on PFP—pitchers’ fielding practice, so you can get set to field one of those comebackers.
What it all boils down to is just plain common sense. My incredible pitching coach of way back firmly believed in that. 8)

[quote=“Zita Carno”]
I realized that this was the real key to a pitcher’s power—the hips were the connection between the lower and upper halves of the body and it was necessary to get them fully involved. This is what the Hershiser drill is all about—getting the hips fully involved and establishing that connection—[/quote]

and therein lies the reason we train our guys as much as possible with their feet on the ground… and not in selectorized machines like Nautilus/MedX/Cybex, etc…

It’s definitely a reason, otherwise the classes would be a lot more accessible.

I’m theoretically in this to make money too. I’m not going to lie. But you don’t shill a $60 mouthpiece and say you’re not in it for the money. Sorry.

Do you have a rebuttal to the other points I brought up?