Mech vs Strength

Oviously mech plays a large role in pitching and we all see that. But what we cant see is phiscal strengh. What role does this play in pitching? Tim has great mech does he have strength. Now C.C. on the other hand is a phiscally a large man and i guess what you would call a “power pitcher”. How can the two relate? Where should most of your work go to?

Mechancis and Strength go hand in hand. Strength maximizes your potential, the more functionally strong the better pitcher you become. Good mechanics maximize how well you use that strength. Now Tim Linceum is a man with extremely efficient mechanics who posesses the strength needed to repeat that delivery. Same with CC Sabathia, now he is bigger (much bigger actually) yet he has an efficient delivery that maximizes his strength and, like Lincecum, keeps him injury free.

You should concentrate on mechanics and strength equally.

And balance strength with flexibility.

I wonder why you think Tim Lincecum might not be strong. Because he is small?

it’s about body efficiency, and Tim is off the charts.

they’re both important. having efficient mechanics is huge and having strength to go along with it is also important. As someone mentioned earlier flexibility is also plays a big role in pitching.
And personally I think Tim Lincecum is probably a lot stronger than anyone would think. It seems like he has a lot more muscle than fat, and you have to have some strength to do what he does.

Don’t kid yourself - little Timmy draws all his strength from his awesome head of hair! :slight_smile:

tim l is a very strong, athletically gifted pitcher. i think he became gifted by relentless practice under the trained loving eye of his father. his dad is probably one of the best pitching coaches available right now. he studied the game with a passion and passed it to his son. that’s why most of us are on here. there are no shortcut is you want to be great.

and do you REALLY want to be great. are you willing to pay the price and do you know how much it costs? you can’t buy it with money. the currency of greatness is time. about 8000 to 10,000 hours of directed practice. i’ve been around probably 100 ekite level baseball players (those who can play division 1 or better). you know how many of them will put in this kind of time. i can think of 5. the rest are gambling on their talent alone which usually catches everybody in minor league “A” ball. this is where a major hurdle is. if you make it to “AA” or better you are special. can’t do it on talent alone unless you have a chance to go to the hall of fame. that kind of talent comes along maybe 3 to 5 times per decade (10 year period).

take it for what it’s worth. the opinion of someone who couldn’t get to “A” ball but loves the game and watching his son train and play.

It depends on the individual. Tim Lincecum for instance is more of a flexibility/rotational guy. Roger Clemens was obviously a power guy. There is not way to tell what method is the best, but you need a balance of both. I would say strength is more important because it involves stamina as well. I doubt Lincecum is very strong, but his flexibility is great and he has been given a great arm to throw the ball with. Combine that with hard work and what he’s got and you get a quality MLB pitcher.

Could be urban legend who knows

I could have swore I read timmy did 47 wide grip chin ups. If that isnt strong I have no idea what is.

JD, pull ups are a pretty bad way of telling strength. I’ve known guys in the army that can do 100 pull ups whatever they do and can barely bench their body weight. That’d be like saying something like, Roger Clemens could do 84 push ups. Tell me how much he bench presses and squats. I bet his squats are good but his bench is barely over 200.

I totally agree with this statement for baseball pitchers.

Because a pitcher’s mass is usually bottom heavy (well-developed core and legs, less developed lats b/c they’re not as primary to pitching a baseball like the shoulders or scap), I think he’s at a disadvantage when it comes to pullups compared the average weightroom person, or athletes from other sports like basketball or soccer, etc.

Getting back to the original question of mechanics vs. strength …

I think velocity is about 50% mechanics, 50% strength. For example, a Little League pitcher with qualitymechanics can’t throw as hard as a high school pitcher with quality mechanics, who in turn can’t throw as hard as a college pitcher with quality mechanics. Quality mechanics being quality mechanics being quality mechanics, the only thing that then separates these 3 pitchers is strength and physical development. The high school player is older and therefore for the sake of our argument physically stronger than the Little League pitcher. The college pitcher is stronger and more physically developed than the high school pitcher.

So if you combine quality pitching mechanics with optimal strength (which comes from working out, naturally growing and psychically maturing as you get older) – you’ve got a true prospect!

What do you think?

I agree. I do believe that some of it is genetic. I do believe that there has to be a balance in mechanics and strength. I think that you have to have both. If you have strength but no mechanics you can be successful, but probably wont pass a certain point. I think that if you have mechanics but lack strength, it’s the same part. If you have both, then you should be successful, there are exceptions. If you combine some genetics with it, then your set. I agree with Steven that it’s about 50/50.

great mechanics with no arm strength is called a bp pitcher. they are worth $100 per game at the big league level (last i heard).

pitchers with great arm strength and no mechanics blow out over time or can’t find the plate 90% of the time. these guys stay in “A” ball till they figure it out or get released.

the guys that make it have enough arm strength, movement and location to get three outs per inning before they score, most of the time. if you can keep your era under 4 you can pitch a long time.

[quote=“dusty delso”]great mechanics with no arm strength is called a bp pitcher. they are worth $100 per game at the big league level (last i heard).

pitchers with great arm strength and no mechanics blow out over time or can’t find the plate 90% of the time. these guys stay in “A” ball till they figure it out or get released.

the guys that make it have enough arm strength, movement and location to get three outs per inning before they score, most of the time. if you can keep your era under 4 you can pitch a long time.[/quote]I think the question is which one relates more to velocity, not what makes a good pitcher.

the baseball population throws around arm strength as if that is the only part of throwing hard. Bloggers don’t understand tim lincecum’s god given talent and that its individual to him and rare few. I know a kid kyle mckenzie frosh. at tulane-drafted 20th round by yankees- hes 5’10 170lb and condition isn’t great. His arm strength…below average, but the kids mechanics are very similar to Lincecum’s in that his fast twitch muscle fibers complement his flexibility to produce a 92-95 MPH fastball. In mckenzie and Lincecum’s case they have the “golden” arms to support a body being thrusted so fast and far down a mound its freakish. Lincecums arm is so fast he can get away with the arm drag behind his body. Being blessed with so many fast twitch muscle fibers help genetic freaks such as Mckenzie and Lincecum throw low to mid 90s. Lincecum is strong don’t get me wrong- but that doesn’t help HIM with MPH–it provides him with athleticism to consistently repeat his delivery for 162 game season, and the stamina to pitch for 162 game season. In these two cases freak cases its more arm speed rather than arm strength.

For the rest of us, we long toss to build arm strength and increase arm speed. Lifing weights will help our velocity more so than lincecum because we don’t have the fast twitch muscle fibers he and mckenzie were blessed with. Instead, we perfect our mechanics to our athletic ability and lift weights to build mass and improve on our fast twitch musclefibers.

Wow you guys so easily discredit Tim Lincecum without even researching how he trained. He long tosses a lot, and he said going from 150 to 170 lb helped him a lot with his speed. 40 pullups is no joke no matter how much he weighs. One of his friends say he outlifted his 200lb friend in the gym all the time. He was also a quarterback at his school.

Point is, he trained just as hard as anybody (or even more) who throws 90+, and not just “genetic luck”.

My brother at 6’0, 185 lbs and 6% body fat could do the same exact training as tim lincecum and not break 82. When he did play he topped out at 78.