Legit?


#1

http://www.pitching.com/

Seems pretty legit, I mean why would an ex pro ball player rip you off, or send you anthrax in the mail?

Anyone know more than I, and wish to share feel free.

Dan


#2

Dick Mills has some correct theories. But some of them just don’t make any sense. Like long-toss, you need to do it to stretch out your arm and build up arm strength. He has a lot of theories that he supposedly had his son do, and what did he do, hurt his arm 2 or 3 years in the minors. So theres contraversy to some of his stuff.


#3

Whoa!! You’ve opened up Pandora’s box with that one. :smiley:

He’s made a lot of enemies out there with his less than diplomatic talk. I’d suggest you buy his book first. It’s quite good and introduces all of his controversial thoughts. It’s a big book and a hard read in some ways but it might help you decide if you read it for yourself rather than go solely on the inevitable barrage of negatives you will receive about him. He’s saying that everybody’s wrong and that doesn’t sit well with people.

I think he’s got some very good advice on some fronts but, on mechanics, I don’t necessarily agree with it all.


#4

[quote=“dm59”]Whoa!! You’ve opened up Pandora’s box with that one. :smiley:

He’s made a lot of enemies out there with his less than diplomatic talk. I’d suggest you buy his book first. It’s quite good and introduces all of his controversial thoughts. It’s a big book and a hard read in some ways but it might help you decide if you read it for yourself rather than go solely on the inevitable barrage of negatives you will receive about him. He’s saying that everybody’s wrong and that doesn’t sit well with people.

I think he’s got some very good advice on some fronts but, on mechanics, I don’t necessarily agree with it all.[/quote]I also don’t like how he charges for his forums. :evil: Really classless. :lol:


#5

Yeah, definately opened Pandora’s box with this one lol.

This is my two cents, and some more.

Edit: It’s worth noting Mills forums were actually free a few years back, that disappeared when he made his big concept overhaul and such.

Actually I’ll start off by saying that I first started learning concepts from Mills when I was teaching myself how to pitch (around 2nd grade I got his first free pitching report). I picked up some key things from him including the idea that it is not a drive off the rubber, that causes rushing most often, A young pitcher should not throw curves, learn a changeup, and he also had a thing he coined the “power triangle” basically a balanced position at landing.

Needless to say I DID love his stuff and still continue to get his reports.
But since then I have really lost most all respect I had for the man.

Alrighty first issue:

Mills never actually really proposes his idea and comes out with them on the internet. He ALWAYS has to tell you what someone else is doing wrong and how they are obviously clueless.

His poster boys of the program are Barry Zito and his son Ryan.

Both of those guys were in the pro’s (I think ryan was does with baseball and barry an allstar) WAY BEFORE, Mills ever stressed his current theories.
He says oh yeah, Barry Zito used my program, I promise you Barry Zito didn’t use half the crap Mills speaks of now, because he was a star way before Mills changed his ideas.

Zito actually became a star when Mills was still preaching perfect mechanics through practice and longtoss.

The only way Mills used his program with his son if he has since gotten rid of certain elements he hadn’t preached for that long. These coming from the research he says he published in his book, with studies in which he spent 5k of his own money?

You can’t go 10 years in the past to claim you did something that he never told the public about for like 7+ years after the fact.

Either A he sold crap for 7 years, or B he is currently selling crap (maybe both).

I just read Mills interview with Zito from a few years ago, really he should probably delete that, it’s kind of heresy to him.

Barry speaks of using drills to work on mechanics, and what… LONGTOSS.


Here’s another, he says Nolan Ryan threw 105 without using the weight room. Mr. Ryan himself has talked about the numerous weight training he began to use in the majors and how it helped him to a great degree?


He says weight training and weighted baseballs are use less.
I happen to believe in weighted balls, but lets go for the definate of weight training. I can pull up a study that shows bench press improves velocity more than medicine ball throws. If he doesn’t used weight training, or plymotetrics, I’m confused as to what other type of training there is to make someone more explosive. I guess sprint training, but I assume he’s talking about plyometric training.

He says weight training is slow and controlled movement and has no place in pitching.
OBVIOUSLY he has never seen any olympic lifting, probably the most explosive competition on earth.

Another issue was Mills comments on Francisco Liriano and his recovery.

First he should have started the article with, I know more than Ron Gardenhire and Rick Anderson.

He complains Liriano is hurt because he is not fit to pitch. He criticizes that he’s never thrown 250 innings. Well DUH.
He says it’s because of major league conditioning and pitch counts, I think not:

He was an outfielder up until a couple years ago. The minors don’t play as many games, and this is his first year as a full blown starter in his career. And heck he was a reliever half the season.

He also says taht because Liriano felt good throwing doesn’t mean he will feel good pitching. Yes this is true to a degree, but Mills makes it seem that there is zero correlation between the two.


A lot of his marketing is just crap. The majority of his sales of programs were on the old concepts, and I’m quite confident he didn’t give his customers free replacements when he decided the old concepts were complete BS and would not be effective.


Alright with all this frustration I will say I do like:

Mills concept of elastic energy, however some of his statements (discussed in other topics) are missinterpreted data from old studies. He says the arm is completely inactive in the throwing motion, however reference the study he noted and it will be contrary.

I also like how he says how pitchers need to throw off a mound more often. I’m not a big fan of the flat ground bullpen, it hasn’t done me a whole lot of good, messes with my timing, stride, and finish.


Finally I ought to put a disclaimer that a lot of this post is from memory although I referenced his site and blog heavily to double check what I was saying, and what he has said.


#6

I wouldn’t use Dick Mills’s son Ryan not making it to the big leagues as an indication of his program’s worth. Ryan was a talented pitcher who ran into some hiccups along the way. It happens. (It happened with me.) Some of the best pitching coaches I’ve been coached by didn’t play in the big leagues – even some Chicago Cubs minor league pitching coaches, surprisingly. (However, many did.)

Mills’s older stuff is quite good, actually – and very, very similar to Bill Thurston’s stuff out at Amherst College, in Amherst, Mass, which is why I like it so much. There’s a lot ot be learned there, as there is from Thurston’s pitching videos from the mid-'90s (which cost considerably less, by the way).

If you’re interested in Mills’s stuff, but aren’t working or don’t have the dough, try Ebay. A lot of his older stuff floats around on there week after week.

Look, pitching instruction isn’t so much about picking sides so much as it is about learning a little something from everyone. Thanks to the Internet – and Mills’s site, Chris O’Leary’s site, Marshall’s site, Mike Griffin’s site, etc., you’re a click away!


#7

i actually ahve the program and they give u a lot of stuff like 12 vcds and like 4 books it definitely worth the money and the stuff is pretty good too


#8

how much did that end up costing you? and did you get his training vid?


#9

[quote=“centerfield2150”]
He also says taht because Liriano felt good throwing doesn’t mean he will feel good pitching. Yes this is true to a degree, but Mills makes it seem that there is zero correlation between the two.[/quote]

Maybe he was right. Liriano came back and pitched 2 IP on his first start since he injured himself, and had elbow problems.
He will be shut down for the rest of the season and they are considering he might lose the next year also.


#10

good new for Twins fans
http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20060914&content_id=1662846&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb


#11

Haha, I almost cried when I read the initial report on Liriano

Huge twins fan, liked them since they were the worst in baseball so it’s fun to root for them now.

Anyways, initially I thought oh, I guess I’ll eat my words, but I read further.
I came to find out that Liriano threw a rehab start in Rochester and had zero problems. Thus busting Mills theory, which read to me that he would quickly get pain after throwing from the mound.

I should clarify, I think Mills does some good work, a lot I happen to disagree with and his explanations can be poor, but he does have some good stuff. I have actually looked into getting his older stuff on ebay, may eventually do that. Steve’s new book is #1 on my wishlist right now though. Honestly if Mills cleaned up his marketing angle, and actually was a little more productive to the reader I would be more inclined towards his material. I just get tired off reading, everyone is wrong, you should buy my $100 book to find out why they are wrong.