Well, I’ve seen it both ways. Most Baseball America articles that I read use the clock from the hitter’s point of view. Oh well, the ball moves, we know this.

Yeah, either way you look at it we were going in the same direction. Atleast we have somewhat defined the movement of the gyroball. Most people are still uncertain on the movement.

Well the ball can actually move the other way as well, and we’re finding that there are other variations of the pitch. Matsuzaka’s actually may move into a righty at times, but not necessarily on purpose. This may also be the reason why so many people are comparing it to a screwball as opposed to a slider.

The ball actually catches the air the wrong way sometimes and will move the opposite way.

Yes this is true, the ball in the video on top of the page is released at a 45 degree angle, giving it that slider movement. If it was released at a perfect bullet-like spin 90 degrees, it would come down and in like a fast screwball, or splitter with inward movement.

Hi guys - love the discussion. First, let me point out that the article I wrote at Rob Neyer’s site is, in a word, wrong. I wrote this very early in my quest to get info on the gyro and had several mistakes in there that I’ve sinced learned about. I’m still learning and have learned more in the last six months than I knew before.

First, the motion and release causes three different variations using the same motion. That alone is pretty good. I’m not sure all three can be controlled - it’s a very fine difference. One of the problems I had teaching it was that occasionally, the ball would break in to a RH batter rather than away. I know why now, but it’s still very difficult to control.

Second, anecdotally, the pitch is no harder on the arm than any other pitch. I have no data, but of the people I’ve taught, none say the pitch seems to cause much stress.

Third, the pronation comes AFTER release and is to take stress off the arm, not to affect the spin of the pitch. This is a very common mistake in articles and it has confused a lot of people. You can throw the pitch with no pronation, but I wouldn’t recommend it!

Finally, the pitch is easily teachable. I’d be happy to show it to anyone serious about learning the pitch.

Will Carroll
Baseball Prospectus

Wow, welcome to the boards! :slight_smile:

I would love to learn this pitch; how would I go about doing this?

Good to see you Mr. Will Carroll. Fighting the gyro fight…

Wow, this makes the pitch possibly more confusing for me personally.

Although, I still think it would be a great pitch to have.

If throw correctly I think it would work miracles, but it is not a pitch I am looking to have even though I have read alot on it.

Not the easiest pitch in the world to learn

No kidding, I fooled around with it and it is extreamly hard to get the spin that is needed in order to throw it. I gotten a few weird breaks with it. But nothing I would call “mine” or throw in a game.

Do you know how to throw it?

I know how, but I can’t get it right all of the time. I can get like half of it sometimes. But when you get the perfect gyro spin you will know it. It breaks alot!!! If you would like to know just post and let me know and I will post alot of info on how to throw it and other things.

I do know how to throw it, I’m just curious to make sure you do too. Especially to make sure you don’t hurt yourself trying.

Well as with any breaking pitch there is always a risk of injury, but I have read atleast 60-70 articles on it involving, pronation, break, spin, mechanics of the pitch and so forth. I would say when coming to this pitch I am fairly knowledgeable.

Have you tried to throw the gyro? If so, how was your spin compaired to the real thing? And what was the result of your break?

Try and explain how you throw it, just to make sure you’re on the right track. Pronation is less important than ealier reported.

My attempted gyros come out like a slider, but I don’t always release it properly.

Well, I grip it like a 2-seam at the narrow part of the seams. I then go into the wind-up (to get more speed) and then I release with a close as football spin as I can and when I do get a nice tight spin I get a violent downward drop about 1ft sometimes more 1 and 1/2ft and slightly in about 2-3 inches. It is like a straighter and harder splitter. Alot more sharp and alot later is the movement. And when I dont get it to work I get a 2-seam type break. And when I throw this pitch I have clocked it on average at 74mph and sometimes 76-78mph (higher speeds is usually a looser spin for me/less break-moderate). I could be more detailed if you would like.

How do you throw yours?

Well your wrist and hand angle should be the same as throwing a football but the gyro is created by the fingers pulling down and across the ball at release creating the rifle spin. That’s what makes it a difficult pitch to pick up. Remember we’re trying to get 9 to 3 rotation (or 3 to 9 if you would like).

Hopefully Will Carroll will be back on the boards as he can better explain how to throw it.

Yeah, I am assuming you are a RHP and yes when I throw I try as best I can to put the tightest fastest (3-9) spin on it as possible. I am no expert on throwing the pitch, I just know how it is suposed to work if you know what I mean…lol

Yes, RHP, but I’ll stick with Baseball America and use the clock from the hitter’s view, so I’ll call it 9 to 3.

So, once again the key is keeping the wrist stiff and pulling the fingers down and across to impart the spin. Be sure not to come around the ball.