Drop and drive vs. tall and fall?


#1

what is the difference between drop and drive vs. tall and fall? what are the pro’s and cons of each? What body types fit each (short,tall,skinny,muscular)? and who are good examples of each?
Im 5’7’’ 186 pounds muscular. which mechanics would fit me.


#2

Make sure you dont double post topics next time, is very annoying especially when you do it with a topic but… I think most coaches prefer tall and fall. At least thats what my coaches insist I do but I greatly prefer the drop and drive personally. I fell like I have more power and flexibility. Im 5’11’’ and 125 pounds though lol so, I dont know what body type is better for what.


#3

Welcome, man. Ill let some of the other members answer your post, but just wanted to welcome you to LTP.


#4

well i’m wondering because you’re still taller than me, not to mention we have to different body types. I have big legs and a strong upper body, kinda like a short clemens. I’m hoping someone would have some insight but it looks like there a lot of views with few answers.


#5

well i’m wondering because you’re still taller than me, not to mention we have to different body types. I have big legs and a strong upper body, kinda like a short clemens. I’m hoping someone would have some insight but it looks like there a lot of views with few answers.


#6

neither is better, do whats comfortable with you.

Examples:
Drop and Drive: Josh Beckett, Roy Oswalt
Tall and Fall: Verlander? Joe Blanton


#7

I actually don’t find either of these terms very helpful and certainly not terribly accurate. The examples often cited for drop 'n drive really don’t. It’s typically something in between or a hybrid of the concepts in each. There’s so much more going on that these are fairly limiting terms. I think there are better cues.


#8

Dead on dm


#9

well to make it more accurate because it seems like no one has a clue, the key example of drop and drive is TOM SEAVER and noone can say he doesn’t because he explained he did in an interview, tall and fall is theorectical practice of most pitchers today, staying tall throughout motion. I need to know what would be more effective for my body type


#10

[quote=“gorillablue”]well to make it more accurate because it seems like no one has a clue,…[/quote]Interesting way to address the group. I’d have to disagree pretty strongly with this statement and I’m sure I’m not alone on that one.

[quote=“gorillablue”]…the key example of drop and drive is TOM SEAVER and noone can say he doesn’t because he explained he did in an interview,…[/quote]Seaver is always used as the example but take a look at this clip of him.

Where is the drop and drive, despite what he may say? It’s just not there. He may drive, but it’s not after “dropping”. He rotates into footplant like pretty much every other pitcher. He just drops into a very low release. I’d describe it as more like “drive, rotate and drop”.

[quote=“gorillablue”]…tall and fall is theorectical practice of most pitchers today, staying tall throughout motion.[/quote]Sorry, but I don’t see that at all.


#11

how about this!?

“Drift and rotate”


#12

[quote=“Priceless”]neither is better, do whats comfortable with you.

Examples:
Drop and Drive: Josh Beckett, Roy Oswalt
Tall and Fall: Verlander? Joe Blanton[/quote]

If you watch Oswalt pitch it is apparent he does not drop and drive. As he lifts his leg he moves out incredibly fast. And he is not driving into footplant. This implies a linear push. He is rotating into footplant. Same with beckett. I have clips but I cant post them here so if somebody else has a good one please post it.

Tall and Fall is slightly better at describing Verlander, but it still isn’t really a “fall.” This implies passively moving into footplant. It’s more of a drifting followed by actively rotating the hips into footplant.

anyway, that’s my understanding.

Lanky


#13

Good stuff, Lanky. I couldn’t agree more.


#14

The other day I saw a video with Joba Chamberlain and he said that he drives off the mound with his back leg. I don’t see that when I watch clips of him though. Don’t know if that helped any.


#15

I would agree that these terms are very limiting in their explanation and that the reality of the situation is probably somewhere in between.

From what I have seen in a lot of the video I have analyzed, it appears that tall and fall is eliminating the momentum that your body is trying to create, and that there is a need for some level of flex in the back leg to engage all the muscles as the body dynamically delivers itself forward.

I would say Drop and Drive is a little closer to what a lot of hard throwers are doing, but like lanky said, its more of a drifting out of the hip, while retaining some flex in the back leg and keeping the front side closed for a late rotation into a flexed front leg that is ready to absorb the energy of the back side now powering through on foot plant.


#16

How about Tall and Drive? You can drive to the plate without dropping as low as guys like Seaver.


#17

I think staying tall helps on the knee lift, because it allows one to keep their posture and collect themselves over the rubber. The issue from the tall and fall perspective for me is simply the fall part, as if it was a passive maneuver, and we all know you dont just fall into 95 mph.

The idea of driving towards the plate gets you about half way there, in my eyes, as it suggests an aggressive maneuver to the plate, but without really detailing the inner-workings of the body to make it happen…

I mean either way, you’re attempting to use two words to simplify one of the most complex sports movements the body attempts to perform.


#18

[quote=“rhermus10”]How about Tall and Drive?[/quote]How about not using these sorts of terms at all, given that they are inherently limiting and there is so much more to this activity that is important to work on.


#19

Haha, my point exactly