Just want to hear everybody`s opinion on the Dick Mills system because im thinking about buying it
I know you’ll hear alot of people bashing Dick Mills on this website, but I would highly recommend his program. I had alot of doubts about buying it because some of his teachings were against the norm. However, I was very impressed. His program is very well done and helpful. I’ve gained 15 mph in velocity after purchasing his program. I will admit that some of that is simply from growth and small mechanical corrections but I credit much of it to Dick Mills’ program. Even if you don’t want to use Momentum Pitching his Explosive Pitching DVD’s are really good.
I just put a video of him on the Mechs forum just last week…it is kind of a small glimpse at his approach.
Hey little bro, I bought into the DM stuff a few years ago, and now I bought the Tuffcuff program. Dick Mills has very good stuff and right now he’s been teaching thru his programs since 94 or 95 (besides teaching Ryan and his fellow friends) so I guess he has credibility even some or most people won’t agree with his teachings.
The Tuffcuff program is a great source for a pitcher’s fitness regimen, I mean everything is outlined you just have to do the work, that is the tricky part. Everything you buy, read or learn you have to put in action to get results, from a fitness point of view this is a great tool, no magic bullets just plain instruction on how to reach you best potential. I just started the program myself with two kids ( 17 and 16 years old) and I’m very excited about the journey we are getting into.
From a mechanical standpoint you really need to get a good coach that can see your strenghts and flaws and know how to work on them, You can learn the theory of what good mechanics are but my bet is you can’t FEEL how good mechanics are until someone can show you what they are. (hope you understand what I mean)
Mr. Ellis here has a great source for all of us, to find info pitching related. But there are things you need to understand by feel that would be very difficult to understand just by reading this forum.
By the way just so you know I was a pro player for the Minnesota Twins organization from 1996 until 1999, 96’ GC league Twins, 97’ and 98’ Midwest league Fort Wayne Wizards and 99’ Florida State league Fort Myers Miracle, I was an OF as a pro, played 3 years of independent ball in the Texas Louisiana League in San Angelo, Rio Grande and Fort Worth. Since then I’ve been learning how to teach kids properly how to reach their potential, my name is Manny Lopez. Just in case,
Mr. Lopez I definitly appreciate you taking the time to help me, thanks.
here are few things about me,
16 years old
velocity- dont have any of that
I have a private lesson pitching coach that I have gone to on and off for the last 2 years. Before this I had my own distinct style that worked for me, I had that “feel” you mentioned and I was very successful with high velocity until late 13`s early 14. I just wasnt throwing hard anymore not becaue of pain…i just wasnt. This is when i dislocated my non throwing shoulder and was out of baseball a little short of a calendar year.Then i started this with a piching coach and learned a whole “new” way to throw by doing MANY MANY drills. This did help and I have improved my velocity a littttle, im not bad-mouthing my coach or anything but i just think its time to move on because im just slow and robotic with POOR velocity and absolutley no feel for my mechanics. ( ill get a vid up as soon as possible)
I dont mean to be cocky but the fitness aspect of baseball is all i`ve got. Im really into kettlebells boxing medballs and yoga. Im a workout fanatic in my opinion my own style of trainig is the only reason for the little velocity I do have. when I see my mechaincs on video and when i throw I feel like I am leaving A TON!!! of velocity on the table I dont care how it happens or how long it takes or how hard i have to CONTINUE to work as hard as i do and see absolutley no results but i want to bring that out at least to say i got beat with my best rather than what i think is my worst… So now that you know my story what do you thing will help?
wow I typed alot im just really frustrated lol
I really like your attitude, baseball is a very hard game. Just because you have the talent and you post numbers that doesn’t mean you will make it as a pro, you really have to be mentally strong to deal with the ups and downs and sometimes get lucky. Believing in yourself almost crossing the line to cockiness (some go way beyond that line) is a trait of very succesful athletes (Michael Jordan, Tiger Woods, Barry Bonds, etc). That being said, I have to be as honest as possible you need someone to be with you checking your mechanics everyother day. It takes 21 days to ingrain in your muscle memory the right moves, so everytime you go wrong someone has to be there to remind you whatever you are doing wrong. Mechanics are the number one priority, you can be fit and have lots of arm strenght but bad mechanics are just injury waiting to happen. You can’t because of one experience in life stop doing something, look for another coach. Do some research in your area who has been succesful developing pitchers and try him out.
I completely understand where you’re coming from with your situation, he taught you a bunch of drills that made you a robot. That happened to me with the DM products once, was the product to blame? I really don’t think so, it was the approach I took to learn this movements, the pitching motion is a fluid motion so I don’t think getting to positions is the way to go.
I will help you with anything I can, but seriously little bro you need to get some live help. Because sometimes someone here might tell you to do something and maybe you will not grasp the concept right.
Anyway if you work on your mechanics and a long tossing program and your are fit for a pitcher (notice I said for a pitcher) you WILL increase your throwing speed, no doubt. I don’t want to sound like a salesman but Tuffcuff is a great tool if you are willing to do the work, there’s no KB’s theres but with proper knowledge you might be able to incorporate a couple of moves. Tuffcuff plus the Complete Pitcher Ultimate Guide to advanced pitching philosofies by Mr. Ellis are well worth 75 bucks in my opinion.
Let’s do something post your pitching motion from a side view, front view and back view. I will tell you what I see that you need to work on and give you a couple of drills to help you out, these drills are already here in this webpage so I’m just going to show you where to go, then all the work and of course the merits are going to be all yours!!
First off thanks alot for your help,The video is coming shortly. I was shocked to hear the mills product got you robotic, I figured it was the anti robot product. With an explosive stride i figured my now slow arm would have no choice but to take its natural path and whip through the zone.
question… I agree, I need to find solid simple mechanics then just rep rep rep rep rep until its muscle memory. However im still looking. So Does Mr. ellis have things about mechanics or mostly workout?
[quote=“oslv”]I completely understand where you’re coming from with your situation, he taught you a bunch of drills that made you a robot. That happened to me with the DM products once, was the product to blame? I really don’t think so, it was the approach I took to learn this movements, the pitching motion is a fluid motion so I don’t think getting to positions is the way to go. [/quote]In the last couple of years, he’s completely denounced what you just described. Drill are now bad and robotic motions is the exact opposite of what he wants. You are referring to some very old stuff from Mills. The new stuff is quite different.
So then me getting the current explosive pitching set from mills makes alot of sense then?? umm rite??
Good for him if he has changed his approach since then, Rock my little friend life is a game of choices. I’m not sure what he’s preaching now but I have a better sense of what correct mechanics are and how to work on them. Steven Ellis has another book called Ultimate guide to advanced pitching philosophies that works on setting goals, the mental game, mechanics, gameday approach, etc. that I bought with the Tuffcuff.
If you read the articles on this website you will find tons of stuff that someone can charge a kidney for it, but it’s totally free here. That’s part of the reason I’ve jumped to Mr. Ellis bandwagon, from my point of view he knows what he’s talking about, he’s not selling magic bullets, and he is giving us tons of info for free.
I’ll do some research on DM stuff but it’s hard to grasp the essence because he markets his stuff well but doesn’t tell a lot.
Manny, what a great testimonial for Steven…I agree. Not just as an administator here (Which that and $5 bucks will get you coffee at Starbucks). I’ve seen what he has to offer, I’ve also seen the other guys…actually I’ve just recently posted small snippets of video from Mills and Nyman in order to provide more info for these two trainers. If I could find more stuff I’d keep putting it out there. One contention I’ve always made is that all of the “guru’s” have valuable information, tips and insight that they offer…If you have the money, Dick Mills will even let you come to his house and train and get analysis there. As to the changes…even Tom House continually evolves in his approach…I am not troubled by this…It doesn’t appear that you are either.
What makes this such a special place is that we promote information exchange amongst all of the “experts”…it isn’t a free ride…spout off with unsupportable gibberish and a person will be challenged…but repectfully and I think with class. The kids that participate here are all eager to learn and dedicated to their art…It is why it is such a breath of fresh air…we welcome you here. Not just because you appreciate the work Steven has done but because you seem to be thoughtful and care about our art.
Nyman has made very few changes to his philosophy over the last 10+ years. Going through his pitching forums I’m finding the same kinds of advice given from the 1999 posts as I am in the current posts. Why? Because it’s tried and true. It works, plain and simple. I have yet to see a Mills student using momentum pitching hitting 95 mph on the radar gun. On the other hand, this is quite common for a dedicated Nyman student of 2 years or more hitting low 90s. Let me name a couple who have wholly dedicated themselves to Nyman and reaped the benefits. Richard Stock, USC, I believe he threw low 90s touching 93 mph at age 14 after constant work with his father Gregg since age 11 using SetPro information. Greg credits this success to SETPRO. Brett MooneyHam, 1st round stuff, drafted out of high school in 14th round this year by the padres because of signability issues. Turned down 1.4 million. Throws consistently low 90s and regularly hits 94 at age 18. Bryan Ryder came into college throwing 72, and 2 years later after working with SetPro hit 92 mph in front of 50 college coaches. It’s not a magic bullet program, it’s about becoming a student of the game and learning everything you possibly can about how the body can maximize its throwing potential. Then it’s about applying that knowledge to your game and making the necessary changes. Paul addresses all of these issues fully, and really gets how to develop a high level player and not just the theory behind it. I hope I did his program justice in that brief explanation. I’d encourage anyone who’s thinking of Mills to take a look at Nyman as well. A careful look at each will make your choice blatantly obvious.
JD thanks for the welcome, I really enjoy going thru the articles, Steven’s Blog and of course the Forum. There’s so much info here I hope kids don’t take it for granted, I mean I have seen a couple of things I didn’t even remember just because I don’t run to them very often, for example I ran into a drill that’s helping me with a kid and his lateral head movement.
Even though it doesn’t say it’s for poor head movement I’m using the high cocked position drill, so he feels where his elbow should be. I stand beside him and keep my hand on the side of his head so he can FEEL how a higher arm slot and head staying in place can better his command and allows him to throw without stressing his arm. He doesn’t have it yet, but he says it feels more natural, after 5 movements like that I let him throw 3 balls so he can incorporate the feeling to his whole throwing mechanics, remembering always pitching is a fluid motion. Sorry for the long example :lol: I kind of get a little carried away jeje.
On the other hand LankyLefty, what’s the common denominator for all people who get to those desireable 90+ pitching velocity?? brother it’s just hard work with a good gameplan. Notice how you wrote about all these kids working on a well designed program for two years, not 2 or 3 months, two years!!!
In my home country kids don’t have acces to DM, Paul Nyman, Tom House, Dr. Mike Marshall, etc. And still they find a way to throw those 90+ rockets down the plate, why? because they follow a program that works with everything (mechanics, arm strenght, fitness, rotator cuff) and they stick to it.
I followed Nyman for a while, read his stuff. Became fascinated with the weighted ball program, but never gave it a real try so I don’t think I can make a fair judgement. But my point is guys do your research, don’t downplay anyone’s program just work on the one you believe you can benefit the most and work as hard as you can, by hard I don’t mean overtrain, what I mean is that you should do what that program has outlined for you and don’t take days off when you are supposed to work.
Pitching is a very demanding phisical activity, that’s why Pro teams pay the big bucks :o